740 Broadway, Massapequa

[jdw]

New joint in Massapequa advertised on CL. Visited yesterday. Bad feeling from beginning when a camry with Pa. plates was parked on side of building next to fire hydrant with asian girl wearing sunglasses talking on cell phone. Place advertises 'very sexy girls'. At this point I figured I made the drive so WTF. Rang bell and was let in by 'Anna'. Saw mammasan, pretty sure she was the same one from 1492 Wantagh Ave. Anna was a 6.5 in looks but don't think she went to AMP school. 50 for hr. Gave a 3 minute light rub then asked what else I wanted. She wanted 100 for fs. After the lame attempt at massage the last thing I was going to do was reward her with a large 'tip' Ate the p**** until she gave a lame fake or****. Gave me a hj with no oil where she practically pulled the boy off my body. Some asian guy came in to talk to the mammasan at the entrance so Anna let me out the back door. The camry girl was still there but left as soon as I approached. Will not repeat or recommend as for 70 I have had much better times. Left feeling very uncomfortable. Hope this place is gone by next week or they get better girls.

[swiggy]

Was here today at about 4 they have parking in back. Says Jenco gifts on the front. front door is locked , girl who answered the door was about a 7.5 as far as amps go. She was ok looking , around 35-40 with big tits , like a big c-cup . Asked me if i was there before ... I said yes. They have cubes that dont go to the ceiling with a curtain and a sliding door , private enough. Was quoted 60 , i said that i saw on internet says $50 so she says ok 50 half hour and i say no it says 1 hour... she says ok with no hassle. I give her a c-note and different girl walks back in with my change. Name was Mae , hard to describe her , some would say cute and some would say ugly . i found her kinda cute. she had a round face and her teeth were a bit fucked up but she smiled and giggled which made her more attractive to me. Wore a spaghetti strap top and shorts and she had nice tits , big b or small c. She had a bigger bottom than most asians , a little chunky below the waist. Massage started out as a lame rub but got better. She kinds squeezes a lot instead of rubbing , hard to explain but i liked it overall . She did the reach under , which i like and blows on your balls. I turned over and pulled her toward me . She said wait and she would be right back. Came back 3 minutes later with a washcloth , cleaned off my johnson. I took off her top and pulled down her shorts. Didnt want any digital insertion but i was just really doing some recon. She put a paper towel on the floor knelt down and went right to it, had the condom in her mouth. Good job as she was a pro , took some direction and didnt stop 2 minutes in to ask if i was almost done. She knows what she is doing and makes some litle noises, nothing over the top and kept going as i was coming . Smiled and said thanks when i gave her the fifty she brought back when she came in . Place sounded busy as the phone rang about 4 times and bell rang 3 times. guy came to the door and asked how much she said 60 , he also asked how many girls she said 3, he told her he would be back. I saw 2 of the girls and they were pretty good by amp standards. Overall good attitude , decent looks and superior job for Long Island.

[corrupt]

Ballsy Location - 7th prct will likely be all over that in short order.

[swiggy]

Ballsy Location - 7th prct will likely be all over that in short order.

why do you think its ballsy? I'm just curious as maybe 4 or 5 other places have come and been shut down in this same area and i don't know of anything that is close , but I don't really know the neighborhood

[dikipedia]

Was out in Long Island yesterday and decided to give this place a try. Tried going around back first, no answer. Went around front, was let in, preempted the "have you been here before" question by saying last time I was told to I could come in through the back (the double entendre was clearly lost on mamasan).

Was shown to room, gave her 40 for the half, she said "no, half hour 50." I started to put the money back into my wallet, she said "OK" and grabbed the money as well as my crotch. I got undressed, in walked a different girl to do the massage (never got name, sorry).

First thing I did was lift up her shirt to suck on some very juicy nipples. She offered no resistance and helped me uncover her beautifully shaped breasts (probably a small C). As I took the first one out of my mouth and moved toward the second, she stopped me, pointed to my pants folded on the chair and asked me "how much you tip." I told her I usually tip between 20 and 50 depending on the service. She then picked my pants up and handed them to me, said "you tip now." I took my pants, but instead of going for my wallet, I put them back on and told her I wanted my money back because there is no way I was going to tip her until we were finished.

She left cursing something in Chinese and mamasan walked back in 20 seconds later, took off her shirt and said "I do, OK?" I said fine but that I'm not tipping until after the massage. She said OK, and pushed me back on the table. I tried to sit up in order to have more access. Her chest was at least a large C, also nicely shaped, and I very much wanted to suck on them, but she wasn't having it and pushed me down on the table front side up.

The HE barely lasted a minute. Not sure why I was so turned on, possibly because this was the first time in a while I've been to an AMP with large chested girls, but it was a record for me. Clean up was a paper towel at first, and then she went to get the hot towel, which wasn't so much hot as it was wet.

So now I've been in there for all of about 4 minutes, most of which was spent arguing with the first girl, and she holds out her hand asking for a tip. I said what about the massage. She said "next time" and repeated her request for a tip. I said "next time" and left.

I am normally not the type to stiff someone (no pun intended) and always leave at least 20, but had really wanted a massage as I was having back pain since the weekend. I'm sure the massage would have been lousy anyway, but I paid for 30 min and wanted to spend the rest getting massaged.

So in conclusion, this place is not about the massage at all, and they will push you out as soon as you pop. Full menu is definitely available here, but you will be pressured to pay up front and the service will be based on the tip, not the other way around.

With that in mind, if you are a chest man, and don't mind the high pressure sales situation, this place is for you. Of the two girls I saw, both were blessed up top. Faces and the rest of the body were nothing to write home about, but I couldn't take my eyes off their chests and barely remember what their faces looked like. Despite the negative experience, I may return the next time I'm out on the island and have a little bit more cash to spend.

[dikipedia]

Saw mammasan, pretty sure she was the same one from 1492 Wantagh Ave.

I could be wrong, but I don't think it's the same mamasan. Unless the one I thought was mama was just one of the girls, but I didn't see anyone from 1492 during my visit.

[genius]

...With that in mind, if you are a chest man, and don't mind the high pressure sales situation, this place is for you. ....I'm not.
I do, very much so.
It's absoultely not.

This is the kind of place that I'm outa there in a couple of minutes with my money back and no tip only to return when there is a change of management and staff that I predict will happen here soon as there won't be any return customers and most who read your review won't go there in the 1st place.

[smoke2]

I stopped by this place yesterday. Went in thru back entrance. Middle door with doorbell and camera above the door. Mama squeezes my dick as i enter the place and asks me if i been there before and of course I say yes ans I squeeze her tits, which were very nice by the way. She escorts me into the room and asks for 60 and I counter with 40 for a half hour and she says no half hour but I say yes there is half hour cause thats what I had last time, She takes my money and closes the curtain for me to get undressed. I was kinda hoping she would return because I wanted to get those big tits in my hand and mouth. Instead in walks Mae (I asked her name as she walked in). She was ok looking but there was one major problem. I hope to god it was allergies. She sneezed non stop from start to finish of our 23 minute session. The lame 2 minute massage was followed by her reaching under to play with my junk. Here is where it started to get weird. She tells me i cant touch her because she has allergies. I say its ok if its only allergies and she got very mad every time i tried to touch her, Kept saying next time, next time. I was started to get aggravated and i think she could sense it so she said she would be right back. I was then hoping she was so upset that she was gonna let mama finish the massage, She was gone for what seemed like at least 5 mins and maybe closer to 10. by this time my excitement had faded and she was upset she had to start over but hey what the fuck????? Shes the one who left for who knows what reason. So she then went back to getting it done and would pull away any time i tried to touch her, I couldn't even get the top off to see her tits. She did however finish the job and i gave her 20 which she wasn't happy about and she kept telling me more next time and i told her don't worry there wont be a next time, Im not coming back. I don't know why I even try new places anymore. I should just stick with my handful of places that always give me the quality service i like and enjoy

[dikipedia]

I'm not.
I do, very much so.
It's absoultely not.

This is the kind of place that I'm outa there in a couple of minutes with my money back and no tip only to return when there is a change of management and staff that I predict will happen here soon as there won't be any return customers and most who read your review won't go there in the 1st place.

Yeah, I probably should have stuck with my initial assessment and followed through with the refund, but when mama walked in and took off her shirt the blood flow left my brain for another organ and I lost control. Every tactic I've learned from your posts went out the door and I just let her take over.

But as negative as my review was, I've still been walking around with a smile every time I think about those huge bags hanging off mamasan's chest. I feel like I would have had a better experience if I had brought more cash and paid upfront. I guess my problem was I was acting like this place was an AMP, but in reality it's just an ordinary incall which happens to be run by Asians and is disguised to appear like a massage parlor. Now that I know better, I may return after payday. Definitely staying away from Mae though after reading about Smoke's experience. It's probably just allergies like she said, but I really don't need to catch H1N1 from a provider.

Most certainly not your type of place though, Genius. Like I said, only two reasons to go here. Two luscious, juicy reasons, but other than that it's probably more hassle than it's worth.

[smoke2]

I felt mammas tits over her shirt but i didnt get to see them but from the way ur talking they must have been really nice, I cant believe im saying this but i may have to go back and insist on mama this time

[dikipedia]

I felt mammas tits over her shirt but i didnt get to see them but from the way ur talking they must have been really nice, I cant believe im saying this but i may have to go back and insist on mama this time

If she was just a regular (non-Asian) provider it probably wouldn't have seemed out of the ordinary, but I'm used to AMP girls with nothing more than nipples so it was a turn on for me. Only abnormality was a small red spot about a 1.5 inches above her left nipple (possibly a beauty mark, or at least that's what I'd like to believe). In any case, I was restricted to hand access, but that could have been because she sized me down as a cheap monger after my argument with the first girl, who also had a nice rack, though a little smaller than mama. She (1st girl) let me suck on them for about 10 seconds before asking for tip, mama didn't allow sucking, but I assume that would have changed if I paid more upfront. Might be worth a second visit, but I'd feel bad if you had another lousy experience all because of my tit-crazed review.

Also, I didn't hear any sneezing at all when I was there the day before you, but then again I was in there for less than 5 min.

[smoke2]

My visit was 23 minutes total and keep in mind she disappeared for about 10 minutes of it and she must have sneezed 30 or more times

[Happyhiney]

My visit was 23 minutes total and keep in mind she disappeared for about 10 minutes of it and she must have sneezed 30 or more times

Since most men need about 2.6 minutes from stimulation to ejaculation sounds like you had plenty of time to spare. (LOL)

[popeye363]

I hit this place over the weekend. Parked on side street a couple of blocks away. I went to the front door (completely covered with something like wrapping paper), rang the bell, and (I presume) Shishi opened the door, let me in, immediately squeezed my goods, and led me into the first room. Room had a full-length curtain over the doorway, and a sliding door which reassured me greatly. She wanted 60 for the hour, but I took the half for 50... still too much.

She was dressed in a tank top with her ample boobage spilling out the sides. After returning from wherever they run to hide their money (never very effective, according to bust reports in the paper), we negotiate for the full deal -- her English was not great, but she understood the raised index figure. Again, too much; I must learn to negotiate better. Thankfully, her second trip to the "bank" was brief.

This is a fast house, make no mistake. She wanted one and done, and popped out of her clothes in a flash. Not so fast, I want to nuzzle those puppies. Nice ones, I can't tell real from fake with any authority but they were fun. I positioned her on the table for an inspection of her nether regions -- very lightly furred. I gave a quick lick, but she tasted so awful that I couldn't bring myself to daty, which I usually enjoy. Oh well. She hopped up and lubed herself, gave just enough bj to apply the condom, and went through the triathlon -- cg, doggie, mish.

The downside, which is why I won't be back: the place is like Grand Central Station. (Actually, GCS is the post office; Grand Central Terminal is the railroad depot. Little-known fact.) The phone must have rung four or five times in the brief (25 minutes) time I was there, and at least two visitors came to the front door. Thankfully, as we were starting to get into it, she ignored the call that came at that inopportune time. There were two other girls there, I believe, but I didn't see either of them.

She was apologetic about how busy the place was, but didn't (appear to) speak English well enough to respond to my question about when is a quieter time. Clearly, Saturday afternoon is no time for leisurely pursuits here! She offered me a water as I dressed, and escorted me out the back door, indicating that I should use that door in the future. Shishi didn't see the young Asian man sitting on the curb back there, no doubt from the sushi restaurant next door, but he saw me. I gotta believe he's wise to the activity.

premises: 6/10 (clean, solid doors, much too activity on a main street)
face: 5/10
body: 8/10 (if you like busty, petite Asians with no backside)
action: 6/10 (no "you come now" talk, thankfully)
return: nah.

[corrupt]

why do you think its ballsy?

4 or 5 other places have come and been shut down in this same area

I think you answered your own question.

[swiggy]

I think you answered your own question.

well it would only be ballsy if you knew about the other busts.

[swiggy]

well it would only be ballsy if you knew about the other busts.

actually It would be ballsy if THEY knew about the other busts , quite possible they know nothing about Long Island at all.

[nabbeun]

I am normally not the type to stiff someone (no pun intended) and always leave at least 20, but had really wanted a massage as I was having back pain since the weekend. I'm sure the massage would have been lousy anyway, but I paid for 30 min and wanted to spend the rest getting massaged.

let me see...so you got a HE and stiffed the girl.

you certainly proved out the first girl's assessment of you. and the reason she treated you that way was of course because she had been stiffed by customers in the past, after delivering the HE.

im no expert on places like this. but i would think that once you suck on a girls tits and she yanks your pud, she deserves something.

not much to be said for the excuses either...lasting 4min is your issue...spank the monkey before you go if you have too. a sore neck...then insist on the massage. or get it first.

really i hate reading stuff like this because you know youve guaranteed the girl will have a piss poor attitude for the next few customers at least, if not permanently. hopefully i dont walk in right after that scene.

[nabbeun]

actually It would be ballsy if THEY knew about the other busts , quite possible they know nothing about Long Island at all.

swiggy you can be sure they know about all the busts...and sooner than you or I get word of it in the paper. word of mouth travels very fast on the circuit. funny ive even had girls ask me to look up the bust report in the papers and txt it over to them.

btw girls are afraid to work in LI. they are all under the impression that a single bust leads to eventual deportation...vs NYC, its simply a fine. so girls that choose to work in LI are already making a hard choice to go there. they just hope they are not one of the unlucky ones. Im not sure what happens to them if they get caught and deported, before paying back the 30-50k debt it took to get them here.

[dikipedia]

you certainly proved out the first girl's assessment of you. and the reason she treated you that way was of course because she had been stiffed by customers in the past.

You know in all honesty, I did have second thoughts about that later on. I do see your point and don't entirely disagree. The only thing I will say in my defense is that I made it very clear that my tip was contingent on receiving the massage. She was the one who decided it wasn't worth her time to spend the next 20 mins massaging me when she could do two FS sessions in that time. The tip was offered, she passed.

I had gone into this place thinking it was an AMP based on their CL posting. Instead it turned out to be a fast house. If I wanted FS I would have paid in advance as is customary, but more than anything what I had really wanted on that day was a massage. Had I known it was not offered there I would have selected a different establishment. In retrospect, I should have just left with my refund at the very beginning, but mamasan's chest put the "deer in headlights" effect on me.

im no expert on places like this. but i would think that once you suck on a girls tits and she yanks your pud, she deserves something.

For the record, it was the younger provider who allowed me to suck her tits for all of about 3 seconds before refusing to massage me. If she had done the HE I would have tipped her at least 20, possibly as much as 40 depending on the experience, as I know she would not get anything from the money I paid to the house. But since it was "the house" that gave the HE, I did not feel obligated to give any more after such a rushed experience.

I have always tried to do right by these women who service me. A recently found regular of mine in Queens, for example, has been giving me bbbj for 50 (on top of the house). She never asked for it, but this is what I usually give. This last time, I only had 20 on me after paying the house. Rather than allow her to proceed with the bbbj and be disappointed with a tip that was less than expected, I told her before hand what I had to give and that I wouldn't hold it against her if she only did HE this time. She decided to give me bbbj anyway, so I will make it up to her the next time. I value the bond I feel when I am with her and am appreciative of the fact that she doesn't make me feel like it's only about the money (even though in reality I know this is why she does it). When a provider is rude to me and makes me feel rushed, on the other hand, it cheapens the experience. This is reflected in the tip. Do I feel bad? Slightly. Will I lose sleep over it? Absolutely not.

[nabbeun]

i see, she declined the massage...and that was after misleading you into believing it was an amp.

well...then that makes sense

sounds like you caught her off guard, requiring a massage... ;)

[donjuan73]

I tried this place out recently, and was met with pretty much the same treatment as everyone else. The girl I saw actually let me play with her tits for about 2-3 minutes, then it was like I was on a time clock. She didn't even wait for me to completely undress. I had my jeans wrapped around my ankles, and was sitting up on the table while she frantically yelled' "cum...cum...you cum now ok?...cum..cum..yes, yes..come! I finally did, and couldn't have gotten out of there quick enough. I gave her a tip of .3 out of the kindness of my heart, but it was definitely not worth it. Would I repeat? No.

[oldfool]

Oh Man. Worth every penny. Rather do it myself.

[lepke]

Some of you guys are just fuckin cheap and ruins it for the rest of us. I pay 80 bucks at my regular massage place that is 100% legit and tip the girl 20 or 30 bucks. How do you stiff a girl and sleep well at night. These poor bitches work crazy hours and work their asses off most of them. The minimum tip should be 40 bucks even if you get a half hour. Don't hand them 10 or 20 and expect them to do back flips for you. Come on 40 bucks? I love you guys that go for the 30 minute quicky special and then want 20 minutes of massage followed by a 10 minute hj while you finger and strip the bitch down to bare ass all for 20 bucks. STOP PLEASE...

[nabbeun]

exactly. maybe this place sucks, but generally it is hard work.

[genius]

... The minimum tip should be 40 bucks even if you get a half hour. ...Really? I guess if they find the $20 tip for the half hour inadaquate they can always get a job at Wendys or McD and net $40 or so for an 8 hour day.

[Zwoof]

minimum tip should be $20 (not $40) and only give more if earned (more than hj)...if a normal work year is 2,000 hours...$20 every half an hour would be $80k in cash...that assumes the girls get none of the house fee too...now if they're not busy every half an hour...sux to be them...don't take it out on the paying customers

[paperpusher]

minimum tip should be $20 (not $40) and only give more if earned (more than hj)...if a normal work year is 2,000 hours...$20 every half an hour would be $80k in cash...that assumes the girls get none of the house fee too...now if they're not busy every half an hour...sux to be them...don't take it out on the paying customers


Too funny. You think they have clients lined up every half hour. Some days some of these places, the girls have no clients at all, like on a Monday.

[paperpusher]

Some of you guys are just fuckin cheap and ruins it for the rest of us. I pay 80 bucks at my regular massage place that is 100% legit and tip the girl 20 or 30 bucks. How do you stiff a girl and sleep well at night. These poor bitches work crazy hours and work their asses off most of them. The minimum tip should be 40 bucks even if you get a half hour. Don't hand them 10 or 20 and expect them to do back flips for you. Come on 40 bucks? I love you guys that go for the 30 minute quicky special and then want 20 minutes of massage followed by a 10 minute hj while you finger and strip the bitch down to bare ass all for 20 bucks. STOP PLEASE...

IMHO, very little about your post is accurate. First of all, (and I am getting tired of saying this), you arent gettting a massage. You are getting a lazy ass poking (what they call accupressure) or lotion and rubbing in circles of your fless (and they call that Swedish massage). Very few are trained. Go to flushing to the legit massages and see what HUGE difference the chinse can do. So you are proposing to tip for exceptionally poor service. That represents the 2/3 of the time spent. Most guys are clueless and do not know what a real massage is. Also, do you tip your waitress $30 on a $60 bill?

Yes the HE is worth tipping but it represent a few minutes of touching your private parts. Most women will allow UTC top and OTC bottom where they where thick vinyl pants. They hardly feel anything. If the guy comes, it worthy of a tip, but depending how cooperative they are. IF bottom comes off I can agree on your $40 tip, but you probably tip $80.

Money does not always buy you better service. The interactions with the girl most likely will. I have gotton free, yes free FS (not boasting), by developing relationships with them as a friend. The money was not the motivating factor.

[lepke]

Really? I guess if they find the $20 tip for the half hour inadaquate they can always get a job at Wendys or McD and net $40 or so for an 8 hour day.

You are way too smart to believe this analogy. The girls at Wendy's aren't risking getting arrested by going to work. They also do not have clients every half hour or hour for that matter. If the chick refuses to give you an hj then no tip and a walk out is fine in my book. We don't go to these places for legit massages. Some girls do give pretty good massages and standard hj I never tip less than 40$ for this.

[lepke]

IMHO, very little about your post is accurate. First of all, (and I am getting tired of saying this), you arent gettting a massage. You are getting a lazy ass poking (what they call accupressure) or lotion and rubbing in circles of your fless (and they call that Swedish massage). Very few are trained. Go to flushing to the legit massages and see what HUGE difference the chinse can do. So you are proposing to tip for exceptionally poor service. That represents the 2/3 of the time spent. Most guys are clueless and do not know what a real massage is. Also, do you tip your waitress $30 on a $60 bill?

Yes the HE is worth tipping but it represent a few minutes of touching your private parts. Most women will allow UTC top and OTC bottom where they where thick vinyl pants. They hardly feel anything. If the guy comes, it worthy of a tip, but depending how cooperative they are. IF bottom comes off I can agree on your $40 tip, but you probably tip $80.

Money does not always buy you better service. The interactions with the girl most likely will. I have gotton free, yes free FS (not boasting), by developing relationships with them as a friend. The money was not the motivating factor.

You guys want to make this like going to the diner for dinner. Do you understand that you are in an illegal place that could get popped at any time. The 30 to 60 minutes that you are there represents a very small amount of time that something can happen. The risk that they take is the reason to tip a little more. The funny thing is I only said to tip a lousey 20 bucks more. This guy wants the bottom to come off before he parts with 20 bucks more. I'm happy you got free fs thats great. I get good service in the places that I go, because I treat the girls with respect and tip according to how much I liked it. When I show up the owner down to any girl that deals with me knows to give me good service because I tip well. I never give less than 40 I just wont repeat with a girl that sucks, however I might want to try a different girl at the same place and believe me they talk. If you are cheap just pass on the place because none of the other girls will give you what you want either. Some of the guys these girls have to massage are dirty and smell badly. Some are just really fat which makes it harder for them. I think of these things when I tip.

[lepke]

IMHO, very little about your post is accurate. First of all, (and I am getting tired of saying this), you arent gettting a massage. You are getting a lazy ass poking (what they call accupressure) or lotion and rubbing in circles of your fless (and they call that Swedish massage). Very few are trained. Go to flushing to the legit massages and see what HUGE difference the chinse can do. So you are proposing to tip for exceptionally poor service. That represents the 2/3 of the time spent. Most guys are clueless and do not know what a real massage is. Also, do you tip your waitress $30 on a $60 bill?

Yes the HE is worth tipping but it represent a few minutes of touching your private parts. Most women will allow UTC top and OTC bottom where they where thick vinyl pants. They hardly feel anything. If the guy comes, it worthy of a tip, but depending how cooperative they are. IF bottom comes off I can agree on your $40 tip, but you probably tip $80.

Money does not always buy you better service. The interactions with the girl most likely will. I have gotton free, yes free FS (not boasting), by developing relationships with them as a friend. The money was not the motivating factor.


I don't agree that money does not always buy better service. The first time you are with a girl when she has no idea what you tip this maybe true after that it most definitely is not true in my expierience. When they know you tip well they will usually go the extra mile to keep you. In larger places big tip customers are well known and the girls fight over them. In these tough times a little goes a long way. Try it and see

[RuffToy]

...When they know you tip well they will usually go the extra mile to keep you. In larger places big tip customers are well known and the girls fight over them. In these tough times a little goes a long way. Try it and see

The key is frequency. Tip big in August and return in October, chances are girls are different and/or they don't remember you. If you've got a rep as a big tipper ANYWHERE......you should expect to see better service....but it's the reputation that's key. Since a tip is given AFTER the service is rendered, you've got to exploit your reputation or else it's wasted money. The other problem with being a big tipper is that you feel honor bound to keep up your reputation.

Example, I frequent a LI steak house and always tip the valet guys $5. They know me, never need a ticket, they take care of my car and when I'm leaving they're bringing my car up immediately ahead of anyone else. I've got the rep and have to stick with the tip structure.

[paperpusher]

Tipping big is a relative term. It only works if everyone tips less than you. You need the rest of us to be cheap (wink) for your five dollar trick to work. LOL

If everyone tipped $80, than you are not going to be remembered at all, because that is the status quo.

[dikipedia]

I don't agree that money does not always buy better service. The first time you are with a girl when she has no idea what you tip this maybe true after that it most definitely is not true in my expierience. When they know you tip well they will usually go the extra mile to keep you. In larger places big tip customers are well known and the girls fight over them. In these tough times a little goes a long way. Try it and see

Somebody's got a lot of time on their hands today...

Here's my thoughts. Lepke and Accts are both right. Larger tips can get you better service in some cases, but taking an interest in the girl and building a personal connection can also work, even without exorbitant tipping.

In my line of work (which I'll keep vague for reasons of anonymity), I have customers that pay on different scales. I always make sure that all are treated well and are happy with what they receive, but some are willing to pay more than others, mostly because they don't know about the ones that pay less. With few exceptions, they are all treated equally. When I put together customized quotes, I do so knowing that I can get X amount from one person, and Y from another. I don't feel that I'm ripping anybody off, after all, this is a business, right? On the contrary, they pay what they can afford to, and like AMP providers, I prefer to get as much as I can for my time.

That said, the customers with whom I've built relationships over the years do sometimes get preferential treatment. More than just their business, I enjoy their friendship and will always go over and above for them. Under the right conditions, this attitude can also be found at AMPs if you play your cards right. In these cases, they already know what you tip, so when they give you more mileage you know its because they genuinely like you and want to make you happy.

Large tips can be a shortcut if you dont want to spend the time and energy getting to know your providers, but to me and others like Accts, this is often part of the thrill and it enhances the experience for us as well. Still, if you'd rather pay more and have it be a simple business transaction, there's nothing wrong with your approach, Lepke. I'm sure these girls do appreciate your generosity very much.

But please don’t criticize others for tipping less. Everyone has their own reasons for tipping according to their own scale. For some, there may be a financial reason. The fact of the matter is that many of these girls are very appreciative of their 20 tips. Of course, they’d prefer if all their customers tipped according to your scale or larger, but given the option to take one or two customers like you per day, or 7 or 8 customers that tip half as much, they would take the latter.

I believe it all balances out for them in the end. There are customers like you, Lepke, who tip 40 for an unenthusiastic HE, and newbies who would pay as much as 120 for the same. This balances out with the 10-20 tippers and the ones that stiff them. At the end of the day, they do quite well (or at least well enough that they’re not interested in leaving the occupation for a minimum wage job.

Some may feel that its not fair for an old woman to get less than a younger, more attractive girl, but the fact is they’re in a business where their sex appeal is their product. When the sex appeal declines, so does the value.

If I could afford to be more selective and insist on providers in their 20s, I would stop frequenting long island AMPs and these woman would not have my business.

[dikipedia]

Example, I frequent a LI steak house and always tip the valet guys $5. They know me, never need a ticket, they take care of my car and when I'm leaving they're bringing my car up immediately ahead of anyone else. I've got the rep and have to stick with the tip structure.

Let's hope the valet guy is not on UG or you may have just outed yourself!

[lepke]

Somebody's got a lot of time on their hands today...

Here's my thoughts. Lepke and Accts are both right. Larger tips can get you better service in some cases, but taking an interest in the girl and building a personal connection can also work, even without exorbitant tipping.

In my line of work (which I'll keep vague for reasons of anonymity), I have customers that pay on different scales. I always make sure that all are treated well and are happy with what they receive, but some are willing to pay more than others, mostly because they don't know about the ones that pay less. With few exceptions, they are all treated equally. When I put together customized quotes, I do so knowing that I can get X amount from one person, and Y from another. I don't feel that I'm ripping anybody off, after all, this is a business, right? On the contrary, they pay what they can afford to, and like AMP providers, I prefer to get as much as I can for my time.

That said, the customers with whom I've built relationships over the years do sometimes get preferential treatment. More than just their business, I enjoy their friendship and will always go over and above for them. Under the right conditions, this attitude can also be found at AMPs if you play your cards right. In these cases, they already know what you tip, so when they give you more mileage you know its because they genuinely like you and want to make you happy.

Large tips can be a shortcut if you dont want to spend the time and energy getting to know your providers, but to me and others like Accts, this is often part of the thrill and it enhances the experience for us as well. Still, if you'd rather pay more and have it be a simple business transaction, there's nothing wrong with your approach, Lepke. I'm sure these girls do appreciate your generosity very much.

But please don’t criticize others for tipping less. Everyone has their own reasons for tipping according to their own scale. For some, there may be a financial reason. The fact of the matter is that many of these girls are very appreciative of their 20 tips. Of course, they’d prefer if all their customers tipped according to your scale or larger, but given the option to take one or two customers like you per day, or 7 or 8 customers that tip half as much, they would take the latter.

I believe it all balances out for them in the end. There are customers like you, Lepke, who tip 40 for an unenthusiastic HE, and newbies who would pay as much as 120 for the same. This balances out with the 10-20 tippers and the ones that stiff them. At the end of the day, they do quite well (or at least well enough that they’re not interested in leaving the occupation for a minimum wage job.

Some may feel that its not fair for an old woman to get less than a younger, more attractive girl, but the fact is they’re in a business where their sex appeal is their product. When the sex appeal declines, so does the value.

If I could afford to be more selective and insist on providers in their 20s, I would stop frequenting long island AMPs and these woman would not have my business.

I also always drop a 10 or a 20 on the mamma the first and maybe the 2nd time until they remember me. I may even keep giving the mamma a 10 every time depending. The mama always makes sure the girls know what the deal is even if they are new. It doesnt matter if you don't go back for a month they remember you believe me. It's true that if everyone tipped alot then it would be the norm. I like to think that guys on UG are somewhat in the know, therefor if all of us tipped more it still makes us big tippers since the chesse balls will still torture them with 10 bucks. I also tip big in my normal life. I have found that the little extra gets me what I want. I don't want to wait for a table and I don't want to wait for my car. You don't have to be rich to act rich. If you tip 120 for an hj that doesnt make you a big tipper it makes you a big sucker which I am not. If you couple your larger than usual tip with getting to know the girl and having a good conversation then you will short cut getting extras. I prefer this way and I know some of you guys would rather talk your way into it but im not all that into the chase here.

[nabbeun]

i think this is all interesting, sometimes insightful. and like was pointed out, more than one can be correct. there is a lot of room for variation in tipping scales.

however it seems to me there are some really cheap ass tippers out there. and to the extent that it makes the girl feel badly about having rendered the service for the pittance offered...its wrong.

the girls dont like giving hjs...we can agree on that right? but they do it for the $. I think every girl has a minimum expectation of a $20 tip for the hour r/t. if they get that, they are not happy but not too unhappy either...its just the lower end of the accepted expectation on their part. but tipping less much less...its insulting, and i think, taking advantage of them and their situation.

i would like to see some those same cheap asses try to get away with stiffing or giving a $5 tip for a hj to a white or black american girl. you would be afraid to, because that girl would chew out that cheap ass so bad that the next time it would be hard to get the pecker up for the memory of it. but these guys know they can get away with that kind of bs with an asian girl, so they do it.

just today...I know a girl who did a full hour massage (and this is a GOOD massage from a girl who knows what she's doing), did the r/t, was kind/pleasant, helped him undress/dress, but refused utc roaming. this Massapequa cheap ass figured $10 was all it was worth. she was a little upset, that she made just 'small money' for all her effort. i guess some customers just have no shame.

[RuffToy]

Let's hope the valet guy is not on UG or you may have just outed yourself!

You think I'm the only one who does this?

[Il Pagliacco]

Since a tip is given AFTER the service is rendered,

I tip the valet before and tell him to leave it right in front

[billyS]

nabbeun, let me guess ... you're Asian?

You also seem very angry that we stiff these girls. Didn't you admit in another thread that you date AMP girls?

I'll let you in on how I look at it. I have X amount of dollars to use to get off. I could go to 1F, I could go to Edison, or see a CL girl. It all depends what I'm in the mood for. Bottom line is that I have a wife and family and gf on the side so I don't go crazy on hobby money. I try to get by giving as little as possible, I go for a deal. I do what is best for me. I could give a shit if I hurt some poor little AMP girls feelings. If she doesn't like giving hand jobs tough shit. A lot of people don't like their jobs.

[RuffToy]

I tip the valet before and tell him to leave it right in front

That's the way to establish yourself, later on they know what they'll get from me, so the service is always top notch.

I always tip the mens room attendant too. In fact I engage him in a quick convo cuz I feel kind of sorry for him. It's amazing how many guys bolt out w/o washing their hands just so they don't have to give the guy a single......unbelievable.

[billyS]

BTW nabbeun, I skipped out on a Latina working in an Asian Nail Salon today because she refused to give me a hand job. No hand job no tip. I was already down $40 of my mongering money, why should I loose more.

[nabbeun]

nabbeun, let me guess ... you're Asian?

You also seem very angry that we stiff these girls. Didn't you admit in another thread that you date AMP girls?

I'll let you in on how I look at it. I have X amount of dollars to use to get off. I could go to 1F, I could go to Edison, or see a CL girl. It all depends what I'm in the mood for. Bottom line is that I have a wife and family and gf on the side so I don't go crazy on hobby money. I try to get by giving as little as possible, I go for a deal. I do what is best for me. I could give a shit if I hurt some poor little AMP girls feelings. If she doesn't like giving hand jobs tough shit. A lot of people don't like their jobs.

i honesty dont know how to answer that. would it make my opinion more worthy of consideration if i say im not?

yes, i am angry about guys who stiff the girls and who hurts their feelings. and yes, i do date amp girls so am probably more sensitive to their situation.

and billyS i must admit i admire your candor here, about your reasoning behind tips given and your thinking and priorities reflected in it.

and from a monger's point of view, i too want to tip as little as possible, and get as much as possible for it. however in the process of doing so...i dont see the need to step on the back of their necks to do so.

basically there's an unspoken agreement going on here. you get a hr, she gets a decent tip. we all understand that, right? now you get a hr, but decide her massage was no good/she didn't let me fondle her enough/her pants were so damn tight she couldn't feel anything anyway/she didnt kiss my ass enough/yadda yadda whatever excuse to break the agreement after she has fulfilled her part. that's just shitty, mean spirited, small person weenie behavior.

is it really necessary to go there, to save the $10 or 20 bucks? jeez forget how the girl feels, one's own dignity should not allow it. when you see those feed the children ads on tv, one's first thought should not be 'great this will allow me to get cheaper sneakers...'

we like when we are not required to pay upfront. when the girl does not start the session with the words 'how much will you tip me?' and then require us to get our naked butts off the table to fish the $ out of our pants. but this is exactly the type of behavior you are encouraging. right now they take the risk and wait for payment at the end. they could easily put the burden back on you by telling you to cough up the $ before they touch you or take a hike. we say such girls have a bad attitude. still wonder why some are like that? given your lack of appreciation for the girl's position, can you blame the ones that have such a 'bad attitude' for being that way? i never used to understand it. i guess now i do.

[nabbeun]

BTW nabbeun, I skipped out on a Latina working in an Asian Nail Salon today because she refused to give me a hand job. No hand job no tip. I was already down $40 of my mongering money, why should I loose more.

was this nail salon known for r/t? if it is then you were entirely correct, as she was not fulfilling her part of the bargain.

however if the shop was not known for r/t and you were just hoping for it by toftt with the latina girl, you are being unreasonable. at least show her the courtesy of a $6 tip (15%) that you would confer on any service worker anywhere in the city. just take it out of your budget for misc services instead of the mongering budget. if there is not such budget (i.e., you also routinely stiff taxis, waitresses, etc) then yeah too bad for the girl its just par for this course.

anyway she didn't have words with you about it? latina girls generally are not shy about speaking their minds...

[nabbeun]

It's amazing how many guys bolt out w/o washing their hands just so they don't have to give the guy a single......unbelievable.

yup. but now i have a better sense of who they are after reading this thread ;)

[nabbeun]

btw billyS, sorry about the 'you this, you that' tone. i would restate it in a more general sense, if it were not for the 3min edit rule...

[billyS]

was this nail salon known for r/t?
Yes, a review on a local board said so.

[pudgy.in.the.middle]

This diatribe is more annoying than seeing the 6 nail salons I have on one block in my dumpy neighborhood. The spread of the AMP tips discussion is reaching H1N1 status! Does anyone know what's going on with 740 B'way? Did NCPD shut them down yes?

[sunshyn8]

I know when I go away I normally tip whoever I know will be giving me a service bartenders<keeping the cocktails coming> person delivering the drinks on the beach.. if you know the place that you go to then tipping upfront to the girl she knows to be able to forfil your wants without any questions.. because you will be back and if satisfied there can be more without asking... not saying to push the money higher but you pay for what you get at certain places..good attitudes on their parts make it more enjoyable for us

[paperpusher]

You guys want to make this like going to the diner for dinner. Do you understand that you are in an illegal place that could get popped at any time. The 30 to 60 minutes that you are there represents a very small amount of time that something can happen. The risk that they take is the reason to tip a little more. The funny thing is I only said to tip a lousey 20 bucks more. This guy wants the bottom to come off before he parts with 20 bucks more. I'm happy you got free fs thats great. I get good service in the places that I go, because I treat the girls with respect and tip according to how much I liked it. When I show up the owner down to any girl that deals with me knows to give me good service because I tip well. I never give less than 40 I just wont repeat with a girl that sucks, however I might want to try a different girl at the same place and believe me they talk. If you are cheap just pass on the place because none of the other girls will give you what you want either. Some of the guys these girls have to massage are dirty and smell badly. Some are just really fat which makes it harder for them. I think of these things when I tip.

You have to read a bunch of genius's posts, to realize there is another way that completely contradicts your claims. No he is not making them up, because I personally conformed some of the places and prices.

I have in my wallet the cell of an AMP girl, who said that I have an open invitation to do her in her home multiple pops for probably the cost of a dinner and a gift of $100. The caveat, is that it has to be after 10:00 (the time she eventually gets home). The problem is I have a family and not convenient. I had tried to hookup twice and she agreed, but I cancelled both time. She was very very affectionate at our sessions. And no I was NOT a great tipper.

There are many paths to the promised land. To say that if one is cheap, to pass because they are not getting any mileage is not only wrong but shortsighted. If you have extra cash to throw at a girl, by all means do so. But get more sessions out of her. She isnt doing much most of the day anyway. In the end, you will have more sex and she will have the same money you were going to give her anyway. It is a win/win situation.

The boards are for learning. To not be afraid to take risks and experiment. But You need to learn how to play the game and there are many different ways to play.

[paperpusher]

Yes, a review on a local board said so.


Once the infamous "Ting" absolutely refused to give me a tug and swore that she never did that in her life. The next time I stopped by, she recognized me, but she thought I was an old client and disrobed without asking.LOL

[paperpusher]

You have to read a bunch of genius's posts, to realize there is another way that completely contradicts your claims. No he is not making them up, because I personally conformed some of the places and prices.

I have in my wallet the cell of an AMP girl, who said that I have an open invitation to do her in her home multiple pops for probably the cost of a dinner and a gift of $100. The caveat, is that it has to be after 10:00 (the time she eventually gets home). The problem is I have a family and not convenient. I had tried to hookup twice and she agreed, but I cancelled both time. She was very very affectionate at our sessions. And no I was NOT a great tipper.

There are many paths to the promised land. To say that if one is cheap, to pass because they are not getting any mileage is not only wrong but shortsighted. If you have extra cash to throw at a girl, by all means do so. But get more sessions out of her. She isnt doing much most of the day anyway. In the end, you will have more sex and she will have the same money you were going to give her anyway. It is a win/win situation.

The boards are for learning. To not be afraid to take risks and experiment. But You need to learn how to play the game and there are many different ways to play.


Called the number in my wallet. The service has been disconnected. Rule number 2. Need to keep up the mometum and not let too much time lapse between encounters when you got a good thing going. lOL

[dikipedia]

I find myself somewhere in between billy and nabbeun. I don't consider myself cheap, but at the same time, I am on a budget and look for value in this hobby. I could stiff the girls as some do and use that savings toward more frequent visits, but I would feel bad. I'd rather stiff the house whenever possible, but like accts mentioned, it's not always convenient to meet during off hours when you have a family. So I hobby less and tip 20 on the half (never take the hour), sometimes more if I intend to return, or if extra services are rendered.

I also agree with pudgy that this topic has been overdone, so I'll keep this last post to a minimum, but to address comments about stiffing a girl who gives an HE simply because she didn't allow roaming, I have to say I'm on nabbeun's side on that one. For me it's usually not an issue though, as I've adopted the genius technique and will usually feel such things out before proceeding with the massage. If I'm not happy with her attitude from the very beginning, I get a refund. Disappointment avoided.

[IgetAround]

Once the infamous "Ting" absolutely refused to give me a tug and swore that she never did that in her life. The next time I stopped by, she recognized me, but she thought I was an old client and disrobed without asking.LOL


I never got close to getting anything from Ting in my first two visits there. When I first started reading this board I thought everyone was full of BS. I went back thinking I would be a little more upfront and almost the same thing happened (I didn't have to ask). When I asked why the change of heart, she said I looked liked LE. When I asked why I didn't look like LE Today, she said business was "slow". Whatever that means. This is why every one should remember that "YMMV"!

[Sidekicks]

I find myself somewhere in between billy and nabbeun. I don't consider myself cheap, but at the same time, I am on a budget and look for value in this hobby. I could stiff the girls as some do and use that savings toward more frequent visits, but I would feel bad. I'd rather stiff the house whenever possible, but like accts mentioned, it's not always convenient to meet during off hours when you have a family. So I hobby less and tip 20 on the half (never take the hour), sometimes more if I intend to return, or if extra services are rendered.

+1 here Dikipedia...

[jdw]

For Lease sign in the window. Place is obviously gone.

[lepke]

[QUOTE=billyS;898551]nabbeun, let me guess ... you're Asian?

You also seem very angry that we stiff these girls. Didn't you admit in another thread that you date AMP girls?

I'll let you in on how I look at it. I have X amount of dollars to use to get off. I could go to 1F, I could go to Edison, or see a CL girl. It all depends what I'm in the mood for. Bottom line is that I have a wife and family and gf on the side so I don't go crazy on hobby money. I try to get by giving as little as possible, I go for a deal. I do what is best for me. I could give a shit if I hurt some poor little AMP girls feelings. If she doesn't like giving hand jobs tough shit. A lot of people don't like their jobs.[/QUOTE

Should surprise no one that Billy says this. He trys as hard as he can to get as much as he can for the least amount possible. Genius does the same thing only he is a little more cunning about it. Your choice here guys. Lepke says take the high rode you will sleep better at night. I don't stiff anyone and I never make any of these girls feel badly. I don't go to these places on a mission to get my hand in their assholes and suck their tits for free. Billy I got nothing against you or Genius it just aint my way. I present a different option its up to you guys which way you go here.

[billyS]

Billy I got nothing against you or Genius it just aint my way. I present a different option its up to you guys which way you go here.

lepke, good to see you posting again. I always look forward to your posts.

[genius]

.... I've adopted the genius technique and will usually feel such things out before proceeding with the massage. If I'm not happy with her attitude from the very beginning, I get a refund. Disappointment avoided.I sincerely think my method is fair to both people.

My determination if I am going to stay is accomplished quickly with no wasted time for either of us. If the woman isn’t going to deliver the services (and at the price) I am willing to pay for she can say so and then go back to the long line of customers in the lobby and try to offer them the services she is willing to give at the price she wants.

This is a win-win method IMHO. Neither of us waste our time and neither is cheated out of services or remuneration.

It is a business

[paperpusher]

I use to think that some were being frugal on their dealings with the AMP women. But when you look at the macre economic environment of the AMP business, if you eliminate all the $40/$20 guys out there, you would probably elimated 40% of the customers out there. That would mean alot less jobs for AMP women are clearly are not motivated to do other things.

It is not like these women are turning away higher paying customers or are close to their capacity to give massages (as bad as they are).

[nabbeun]

my intel says a lot (most?) of massepequa guys these days are tipping $10 on the half and $20 on the hr with a good massage, HE and some roaming. the girls i talked to feel unhappy about this...so much work, tired, so little in return. sometimes they are lucky to make $100 a day. coupled with the threat of LE who will not only fine them but its a sure deportation...they are dying to get out of LI and back to manhattan were double (or even 3-4x) is the norm. for one reason or another...some have to stay. i dont hear complaints about $40hr/$20half guys...its probably the average expectation

[nabbeun]

im not going to say any more on this...said plenty already eh? it is what it is.

if the girls arent taken care of the good ones will walk/run to greener pastures (there are a lot of places and a lot of options) and the poor ones who put in little effort and only deserve the $10 will stay. only in the short run can a disjoint between service and renumeration persist. we all reap what we sow...

[dikipedia]

Nabbeun, I'm not from massapequa, nor do I know anyone who is, but even if what you are saying is correct, these girls are still making 20 an hour for rubbing unenthusiastic circles on someone's back. I'm not saying that I wouldn't give double that, but even 10 for the half is better than working a min wage job. If there's not enough business to go around, it's because there are at least 6 AMPs in massapequa, and perhaps there are not enough mongers to go around?

I'm no expert on LE or deportation policies, but I know for a fact that jen, formerly from glen cove ave, was arrested during an LE bust and popped up in syosset a few months later. I don't know the story behind the closure of her syosset office, but she recently emerged in new hyde park. Point is, she wasn't deported.

You do make a valid point about running to greener pastures though, and I'm sure there is more money to be made in NYC than long island, if for no other reason than the increased traffic, but there's a reason most of the LI AMPs are staffed with 60 year old veterans.

[paperpusher]

my intel says a lot (most?) of massepequa guys these days are tipping $10 on the half and $20 on the hr with a good massage, HE and some roaming. the girls i talked to feel unhappy about this...so much work, tired, so little in return. sometimes they are lucky to make $100 a day. coupled with the threat of LE who will not only fine them but its a sure deportation...they are dying to get out of LI and back to manhattan were double (or even 3-4x) is the norm. for one reason or another...some have to stay. i dont hear complaints about $40hr/$20half guys...its probably the average expectation

Lets turn your argument around. I am getting now one full (hour massage and FS) for $120 with a girl under 35. I even posted who and where. Genius has posted likewise. Now I take a massage for one hour/$60 an I am getting a crappy massage (I mean a massage where the girl is simply killing time) and HE, what should I tip this girl? Certainly less than $60. There is huge difference in the value of HE and FS. With a market like that, $30 would be the ceiling in that case.

What the market will bear. If you really like the girl that you are with, do her a favor. Teach her English. Teach her job skills. (I did to my SO) Then problem solved. There is alot of down time in the AMP business. That is the time she should have her lap top out and practicing her English. The problem is there is reason these women are out in LI in an AMP. Most are unmotivated or lazy. So they are vulnerable and they get what they get. They are not powerless like convey.

The ones that made a deal with the devil, well they made a choice. They didnt have too. Most I spoke to, made the choice with their eyes wide open. We all make choices and live with the consequences.

[nabbeun]

see just when i thought i would say no more..

your points are well taken.

its not really $20/hr though. to compare what they make to another job...you must compare total $ in to total hours worked. this brings it down to maybe $10 per hour. Then you have to make a risk premium adjustment (there is little risk of getting arrested working at mcdonalds). finally, there is the willingness to do a dirty job adjustment (have any idea the $ garbage men get paid to do what they do? ;) ). factor in those and to my reckoning, the min wage job starts looking good. but of course that is not really an option for them...the men that brought them here, do not have that kind of patience on debt repayment.

actual LI deportation policies, i have no idea. i'm just reporting the general fear of LI the girls tell me, whereas in NY its a day in jail and $200.

****** re: what the market will bear...your point is well taken. however $120 for an hour massage and FS sounds very cheap...is that really the market rate? sounds more like the best deal out there (and more power to you for it!). i thought fs and a 5min crappy massage was $150-160 outside nyc generally. so the ceiling then be higher than in your example. also its kind of an apples and oranges comparison. fs places...can you even use the term massage for that? at some of the r/t places...the massage is very good (obviously the defunct 740 this thread is about did not fall in the category of real massages). for a good massage, there is value in it; for the HE, additional value. and given that most here have said they go really for the HE...you get the HE whether you take the hr or the half. so really...take the half if you want to save on the massage fee, but since you're tipping for the HE, even the half guys should be tipping $20. $10 is just pathetic.

anyway, yea the ones i'm involved with...i teach them english. they are fast learners, certainly quicker than i learn korean. btw only the younger girls have laptops...i see many fs amp girls with them, but few of the r/t girls.

on the last point...yes they made a deal with the devil. those i know, with eyes wide open. but with partial info. they knew the debt they were getting into. they were given a choice of where to work. but after a week in a nail salon...they see their period of debt stretching out for a long, long time. so they choose this work instead. a lot of girls tell me about their first month...most if it spent crying every night about their decision. but after a month they are more dispassionate about it. its only when they get cheated that some get that same sad feeling again.

[lepke]

see just when i thought i would say no more..

your points are well taken.

its not really $20/hr though. to compare what they make to another job...you must compare total $ in to total hours worked. this brings it down to maybe $10 per hour. Then you have to make a risk premium adjustment (there is little risk of getting arrested working at mcdonalds). finally, there is the willingness to do a dirty job adjustment (have any idea the $ garbage men get paid to do what they do? ;) ). factor in those and to my reckoning, the min wage job starts looking good. but of course that is not really an option for them...the men that brought them here, do not have that kind of patience on debt repayment.

actual LI deportation policies, i have no idea. i'm just reporting the general fear of LI the girls tell me, whereas in NY its a day in jail and $200.

****** re: what the market will bear...your point is well taken. however $120 for an hour massage and FS sounds very cheap...is that really the market rate? sounds more like the best deal out there (and more power to you for it!). i thought fs and a 5min crappy massage was $150-160 outside nyc generally. so the ceiling then be higher than in your example. also its kind of an apples and oranges comparison. fs places...can you even use the term massage for that? at some of the r/t places...the massage is very good (obviously the defunct 740 this thread is about did not fall in the category of real massages). for a good massage, there is value in it; for the HE, additional value. and given that most here have said they go really for the HE...you get the HE whether you take the hr or the half. so really...take the half if you want to save on the massage fee, but since you're tipping for the HE, even the half guys should be tipping $20. $10 is just pathetic.

anyway, yea the ones i'm involved with...i teach them english. they are fast learners, certainly quicker than i learn korean. btw only the younger girls have laptops...i see many fs amp girls with them, but few of the r/t girls.

on the last point...yes they made a deal with the devil. those i know, with eyes wide open. but with partial info. they knew the debt they were getting into. they were given a choice of where to work. but after a week in a nail salon...they see their period of debt stretching out for a long, long time. so they choose this work instead. a lot of girls tell me about their first month...most if it spent crying every night about their decision. but after a month they are more dispassionate about it. its only when they get cheated that some get that same sad feeling again.

There is no point to this discussion. You will never get these guys to understand the way you think so don't bother. They think that the object is to get all you can for as little as you can. Did you ever see the movie the Devils Advocate with Al Pacino playing the Devil. He is says There is Eddie Barzoon fist fucking the whole world. he says to his son kanu reeves " There are millions and millions of Eddie Barzoons sucking the world dry of what ever they can. Taking and taking and taking". They don't care about the reasons girls get into the shit life of fucking and sucking for a living. To an extent none of us do, if we did we wouldn't support the life that they choose. My thinking is although I know that what I am doing isn't right on many levels. I'm married to good woman. I often think about what I want rather than what others need. I am selfish and arrogant. The little extra money that I give these pathetic girls helps me. I feel like at least my extra 20 made them a little happier for a minute. I'm nice and respectful and that also makes me feel like a human. You want to convince guys that look at this as a business transaction that you should pay for 40$ for what you can probably get for 20$ its hits deaf ears and rationalizations. It's a mind set and thats all it is. I don't agree with the way these guys do things so I do it differently and so should you if you agree with me. Getting guys like Billy or Genius to look at this differently won't happen. They have years of expierience and have formulated their opinions long ago. I do not agree with them and have my own reasons that may or may not make sense to people. I do not however have anything against either of them. We in fact have discussed many topics in the past and I respect both of them as i would hope after many years they respect me. I struggle with my own reasons that I hobby. I do things to make myself feel more human. This is not for everyobody but i can tell you that as far as Sex goes in these places I may pay more but i get every bit as much as Genius and/or Billy.

[lepke]

lepke, good to see you posting again. I always look forward to your posts.

Yes you also Billy.

[genius]

There is no point to this discussion. You will never get these guys to understand the way you think so don't bother. They think that the object is to get all you can for as little as you can. .....Actually the way you think is irrelevant to me (that statement is not meant to be insulting - please do not take it as such). It is really quite simple to understand (to me anyway) and it has nothing to do with rationalizations or not caring or whatever thought process you think is going on in my head.

Lets say all the AMP girls got together and signed a pact in blood that they would only accept what you consider to be a fair price for the “sucking and fucking and shit life they choose”.

I would not go to AMPs. The value of what they offer is not worth (to me) the usefulness of the money I have to spend.

The AMP women would not be better off under the new pricing structure as they would be making a lot less per day.

Lets say I had unlimited funds. I would still not spend the extra $ at the "fair priced" AMPs. I would spend the extra with higher end services.

[GMackin]

...
I would not go to AMPs. The value of what they offer is not worth (to me) the usefulness of the money I have to spend...





I'd bet my life you couldn't go a month without...

that statement is not meant to be insulting - please do not take it as such.

[genius]

I'd bet my life you couldn't go a month without...

that statement is not meant to be insulting - please do not take it as such.1. Huh?

[paperpusher]

There is no point to this discussion. You will never get these guys to understand the way you think so don't bother. They think that the object is to get all you can for as little as you can. Did you ever see the movie the Devils Advocate with Al Pacino playing the Devil. He is says There is Eddie Barzoon fist fucking the whole world. he says to his son kanu reeves " There are millions and millions of Eddie Barzoons sucking the world dry of what ever they can. Taking and taking and taking". They don't care about the reasons girls get into the shit life of fucking and sucking for a living. To an extent none of us do, if we did we wouldn't support the life that they choose. My thinking is although I know that what I am doing isn't right on many levels. I'm married to good woman. I often think about what I want rather than what others need. I am selfish and arrogant. The little extra money that I give these pathetic girls helps me. I feel like at least my extra 20 made them a little happier for a minute. I'm nice and respectful and that also makes me feel like a human. You want to convince guys that look at this as a business transaction that you should pay for 40$ for what you can probably get for 20$ its hits deaf ears and rationalizations. It's a mind set and thats all it is. I don't agree with the way these guys do things so I do it differently and so should you if you agree with me. Getting guys like Billy or Genius to look at this differently won't happen. They have years of expierience and have formulated their opinions long ago. I do not agree with them and have my own reasons that may or may not make sense to people. I do not however have anything against either of them. We in fact have discussed many topics in the past and I respect both of them as i would hope after many years they respect me. I struggle with my own reasons that I hobby. I do things to make myself feel more human. This is not for everyobody but i can tell you that as far as Sex goes in these places I may pay more but i get every bit as much as Genius and/or Billy.


There is one serious flaw in your argument. These girls made a choice. It was the lazy persons choice. They made a choice to come to America and not get an education.

My SO came off the plane on a tourist visa just like them, got an educational visa, learned English, took 7 years to do four year degree (English took awhile to develop). Paid for it with a full time job during the day. Got her own green card. It is the much much harder path. But it is doable. Chinese usually are not intimated by hard work. She and her friends all prevailed. In the matter-of-fact, most Chinese I know, took this path.

Now what does that say about these AMP ladies? Few of them are tricked any more. They know the choice they are making. The shit life is the one THEY picked. Also after a few months of this so called low pay, they still stay in it for decades. Why?

[nabbeun]

but did she start with the initial 50k in debt, getting here?

that is really the load that narrows their choices. most are not lazy, and do work quite hard. some are also more comfortable with obtaining formal education than others.

[paperpusher]

but did she start with the initial 50k in debt, getting here?

that is really the load that narrows their choices. most are not lazy, and do work quite hard. some are also more comfortable with obtaining formal education than others.

She nor any of her friends had that load. There are other ways to get here. MY SO would not have taken that path. Choices and ones those women elect.

[nabbeun]

see the last paragraph to post 66. they frequently know the debt they have to repay, but are misled as to the circumstances under which it can be repaid...

[nabbeun]

She nor any of her friends had that load. There are other ways to get here. MY SO would not have taken that path. Choices and ones those women elect.

the ones who do not have that load...are generally from a better position in their society back home and have correspondingly greater choices (and better education) open to them, even if they chose to stay back home.

[paperpusher]

see the last paragraph to post 66. they frequently know the debt they have to repay, but are misled as to the circumstances under which it can be repaid...

One of the greatest myths that are out there, is that they are misled. Yes some have. Most say that because, it is easier for them to live with themselves. Information and communcation flow freely. People charging 50K to strangers to smuggle them into this country is a well known game to the consumers that avail themselves to these services. Certainly their family or friends understand the consequences of such transactions. And yes they are discussed in the press.

A good % of the people that come here that engage in providing have donw so in Asia. They deny it until you know them better. They are probably more providers per 1000 people than here. So it is only natural that some of them come over.

Secondly, all Asian women lie including my SO, to fit their "loss of face" value systems, especially to themselves. It is amazing to watch them do this. My SO denies me living with her and I was there and she did for five years. It is easier to tell you they were tricked and that they were victems, than for them to admit that they chose a life of prostitution. They even start to believe it themselves.

I can go on and have done so in previous posts about Chinese nuances. I strongly doubt that they were fooled most of the time.

[lepke]

Actually the way you think is irrelevant to me (that statement is not meant to be insulting - please do not take it as such). It is really quite simple to understand (to me anyway) and it has nothing to do with rationalizations or not caring or whatever thought process you think is going on in my head.

Lets say all the AMP girls got together and signed a pact in blood that they would only accept what you consider to be a fair price for the “sucking and fucking and shit life they choose”.

I would not go to AMPs. The value of what they offer is not worth (to me) the usefulness of the money I have to spend.

The AMP women would not be better off under the new pricing structure as they would be making a lot less per day.

Lets say I had unlimited funds. I would still not spend the extra $ at the "fair priced" AMPs. I would spend the extra with higher end services.

You mean the services that you either get or attempt to get from AMP girls. Just a regular decent massage with an r/t would not be worth the extra 20 bucks to you if all the amp girls made you pay 40 bucks for 30 minute massages as a tip plus the house fee. You would then just stop getting massages and go to "higher end" services. I assume the higher end services are f/s places. Where would you get a hot looking asian girl to do f/s for 80 bucks consistantly? If you could find this would the hot asian girl spend a full 30 minutes with you. Would the place that you get the high end service stay open for years at a time as many amps do.

[lepke]

She nor any of her friends had that load. There are other ways to get here. MY SO would not have taken that path. Choices and ones those women elect.

Some of them come here on education visas. Guess what? they are not permitted to work in legitimate job thanks to our so intelligent government. There options are limited to both support a roof over their head, and pay for english school. What choices do they have? Return to their shit bag country's or jerk you off. Guess what they choose choice B. Not exactly a freedom of opportuinty is it? Your notion that these girls could take the high road and work legit jobs for their money is just not an option for many of them.

[paperpusher]

You mean the services that you either get or attempt to get from AMP girls. Just a regular decent massage with an r/t would not be worth the extra 20 bucks to you if all the amp girls made you pay 40 bucks for 30 minute massages as a tip plus the house fee. You would then just stop getting massages and go to "higher end" services. I assume the higher end services are f/s places. Where would you get a hot looking asian girl to do f/s for 80 bucks consistantly? If you could find this would the hot asian girl spend a full 30 minutes with you. Would the place that you get the high end service stay open for years at a time as many amps do.

Based upon Geniuses reviews, he most being going to AMPS some weeks at least twice a week. Those $20s add up and would cut into his frequencey of visits. Rarely does he get a so called hot girl and forget about the massage quality. The hot girls are not on the island for the most part.

[paperpusher]

Some of them come here on education visas. Guess what? they are not permitted to work in legitimate job thanks to our so intelligent government. There options are limited to both support a roof over their head, and pay for english school. What choices do they have? Return to their shit bag country's or jerk you off. Guess what they choose choice B. Not exactly a freedom of opportuinty is it? Your notion that these girls could take the high road and work legit jobs for their money is just not an option for many of them.

You can apply and get a temporary work visa while going to colllege with not too much trouble. I know plenty that have done it and probably make more money than a good % of the people on this board. And yes it is an option. I have seen it first hand.

I say this again. Most of these AMP girls are lazy. They may work hard for the hour, but they took this road but they wanted what they perceived the easy money and now they are trapped in it.

Actually, it is the minority that take the AMP path.

[lepke]

You can apply and get a temporary work visa while going to colllege with not too much trouble. I know plenty that have done it and probably make more money than a good % of the people on this board. And yes it is an option. I have seen it first hand.

I say this again. Most of these AMP girls are lazy. They may work hard for the hour, but they took this road but they wanted what they perceived the easy money and now they are trapped in it.

Actually, it is the minority that take the AMP path.

First of all many are not in College they are in language school. They must first pass the TOFL before they can go to College. I do not know when the last time you checked but its near impossible to get even temporary work status. Explain what lazy means? Most amp girls work more hours than anyone at a fast food place. one that I know personally works mon-fri 1pm to 130am not exactly lazy.

[paperpusher]

First of all many are not in College they are in language school. They must first pass the TOFL before they can go to College. I do not know when the last time you checked but its near impossible to get even temporary work status. Explain what lazy means? Most amp girls work more hours than anyone at a fast food place. one that I know personally works mon-fri 1pm to 130am not exactly lazy.

Though I have not checked recent TOFL requirements, I can say with certainty that it is doable and everyone my SO knew from China did do it. I know it is hard to trush someone's assertions on a message board. They now work from the Postal Service to Accupunture to Physical therapy in hospitals.Through an extended network of people, I know dozens, so it very doable.

The average Korean are at AMPS for long hours but actually work a small percent. An average AMP experience requires tham to actually work no more than 20 minutes of the hour they charge. Then they complain. On Mondays to Wednesdays the volume is not terribly high. On the weekends it is different, but I have never seen so much competition or so many places offering FS now since I followed this hobby of hours. It has to cut into the quantity.

[nabbeun]

Though I have not checked recent TOFL requirements, I can say with certainty that it is doable and everyone my SO knew from China did do it. I know it is hard to trush someone's assertions on a message board. They now work from the Postal Service to Accupunture to Physical therapy in hospitals.Through an extended network of people, I know dozens, so it very doable.

The average Korean are at AMPS for long hours but actually work a small percent. An average AMP experience requires tham to actually work no more than 20 minutes of the hour they charge. Then they complain. On Mondays to Wednesdays the volume is not terribly high. On the weekends it is different, but I have never seen so much competition or so many places offering FS now since I followed this hobby of hours. It has to cut into the quantity.

like i mentioned before, i think a large part of the disparity in experience that your SO and her friends had vs these girls comes from their level of affluence back home. china in particular is a society where who you know and what connections you have determines what doors are open to you and which are not. the ones who got here without that debt likely come from families who are at least upper middle class and well connected. or at least well connected and know how to work the system back home.

now with these girls...needless to say, they dont have such means, or of course they would use them. why shell out 50k to get over here if you can do it without? seriously, ive asked...what did you pay all that money for? wtf do they do for you? plane ticket...they line up a job for you and a place to live...but hell, i could do that for them its nothing. so the nearest i can tell, is most of what they pay for, is for these guys to give them a background, fill out the application, coach them and grease the right palms, to get them the papers they need to get a visa to leave china.

your extended network of people, are all connected and likely from that (upper) strata of chinese society...where such a thing is taken for granted or the path to it is at least self-navigable. for the girls that choose the debt route...their only choice is to go that way or stay in china.

re: being lazy. now in LI the hours are much shorter...say 10am-8pm? in manhattan, they are often 16hr days. at least the places i go...they work the full hour i am there. depending on the place, it can vary a lot, but figure at least 5+ customers a day. so 5 or more hours work massaging customers, and the balance of a 16 hr day 'on call' locked up in the shop. sounds like hard work to me. then through in the constant threat of LE...the misc crap of customers stiffing you/ripping you off...the occasional armed robbery (this happens...a lot). lots of work, lots of boredom, and the occasional bouts of terror -

your vol days seem off to me, both for fs and r/t places. at all places i'm told, sat and especially sun are dead, relatively speaking (all the married mongers are stuck at home after all). thur and fri are usually busy, at least the nights. and mondays are often very busy (again, all the married mongers again being set loose...). tues wed just avg steady burn. so really most girls try to take off weekends...

[genius]

...They now work from the Postal Service to Accupunture to Physical therapy in hospitals.The girls that work at the FS place have it much better than postal and hospital workers as they spend less time on their feet (heh, heh).

... but I have never seen so much competition or so many places offering FS now since I followed this hobby of hours. It has to cut into the quantity.and I have never seen more availablity of BBFS. I always tell them I dont have a condom just to see their answer - I get many "OK - no problem" and some "Ok, but cum outside". Needless to say I dont bo[ther with DATY with those girls.

[emperornext]

The girls that work at the FS place have it much better than postal and hospital workers as they spend less time on their feet (heh, heh).

and I have never seen more availablity of BBFS. I always tell them I dont have a condom just to see their answer - I get many "OK - no problem" and some "Ok, but cum outside". Needless to say I dont bo[ther with DATY with those girls.

what places are these with fs? kmp or amps with HEs that u convince to do fs.

[paperpusher]

what places are these with fs? kmp or amps with HEs that u convince to do fs.


All of the above plus chinese FS places and now one lone Japanese FS place. Plenty of them. Read the threads.

[nabbeun]

oh man! please give guidance on finding the lone japanese place please ****** :)

[rre]

japanese place now I find out LOL. I never saw it.

[paperpusher]

oh man! please give guidance on finding the lone japanese place please ****** :)

http://utopiaguide.com/forums/showthread.php?t=36463

[thunderball]

Gone, baby gone. Another one bites the dust.

[Homie]

Look at the last posted date. Did u really think they would still be there?